I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ..something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
Thanks for your help
On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts. Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other
non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my
recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn
somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of
the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ..something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we
use them in gear motors...
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 11:37:50 AM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts.
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other
non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my
recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of
the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ..something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
use them in gear motors...
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
I have three pins, and no proper room to work on this Black Hole. It's a pathetic Rubix-Cube shuffle-dance of storage space.
It's going to be hard enough just getting under the glass. But I thank you for the links. Definitely.
I'll see if the cleaning of the contacts with a white business card works, and look at the flipper bushings. Sounds like that thing really needs to come apart. So be it.
-Greg M.
On 2020/08/29 12:06 p.m., Greg M. wrote:I forgot to ask-
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 11:37:50 AM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts. >> Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my
recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of
the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we >> use them in gear motors...
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ..something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
I have three pins, and no proper room to work on this Black Hole. It's a pathetic Rubix-Cube shuffle-dance of storage space.
It's going to be hard enough just getting under the glass. But I thank you for the links. Definitely.
I'll see if the cleaning of the contacts with a white business card works, and look at the flipper bushings. Sounds like that thing really needs to come apart. So be it.
-Greg M.
Ah, sometimes I forget that folks don't have a 5500 sq ft warehouse with
12 x 12 employee workstations like my little shop. (ducking)
Well, it was little once! Back in 1978 my first shop was around 150
square feet. That lasted me about a year. Next shop was around 400 sq.
feet. That lasted two years. Third shop was 3300 sq ft, that lasted 35 years...
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 12:19:34 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 12:06 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 11:37:50 AM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote: >>>> On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:Ah, sometimes I forget that folks don't have a 5500 sq ft warehouse with
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts. >>>> Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my
recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of
the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we >>>> use them in gear motors...
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ...something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
I have three pins, and no proper room to work on this Black Hole. It's a pathetic Rubix-Cube shuffle-dance of storage space.
It's going to be hard enough just getting under the glass. But I thank you for the links. Definitely.
I'll see if the cleaning of the contacts with a white business card works, and look at the flipper bushings. Sounds like that thing really needs to come apart. So be it.
-Greg M.
12 x 12 employee workstations like my little shop. (ducking)
Well, it was little once! Back in 1978 my first shop was around 150
square feet. That lasted me about a year. Next shop was around 400 sq.
feet. That lasted two years. Third shop was 3300 sq ft, that lasted 35
years...
John :-#)#
I forgot to ask-
Is it OK to spray a hot or three of Radio Shack Contact Cleaner on that same Pop Bumper Switch now that I've burnished it with a white credit card, -before I go and button it up again?
That lower playfield flipper seems to be binding on the nylon sleeves. No way to know without pulling it out. I really don't know how to remove the flipper arm assembly but I'm going to try unbolting/unscrewing the entire flipper assembly bracket and dropping it. I have no idea how to pull the flipper arm out when it's attached from the top of the playfield, but hopefully I can figure it out when I try to drop it. If you can give me any directions, that would help me a lot.
I'll tell you something. Working on that lower playfield to get to the flipper brackets is a pain in the rear. The upper playfield is smack dab in the middle blocking the lower playfield from being able to elevate it anywhere near where I'd like it to be to work on it. (Even when I prop the top playfield up as high as the top playfield can possibly go.)
Thanks again John. I hate that I don't have nice warehouse. That usually doesn't keep me from wrenching on three pins. This time, I'm not so sure. My poor back can't take much more of Black Hole pinball limbo contortion.
-Greg
On 2020/08/29 1:53 p.m., Greg M. wrote:I found those Allen screws. Had no idea what they were there for in that flipper assembly until now.
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 12:19:34 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 12:06 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 11:37:50 AM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote: >>>> On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:Ah, sometimes I forget that folks don't have a 5500 sq ft warehouse with >> 12 x 12 employee workstations like my little shop. (ducking)
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts.
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other
non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my
recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of >>>> the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ...something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
use them in gear motors...
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
I have three pins, and no proper room to work on this Black Hole. It's a pathetic Rubix-Cube shuffle-dance of storage space.
It's going to be hard enough just getting under the glass. But I thank you for the links. Definitely.
I'll see if the cleaning of the contacts with a white business card works, and look at the flipper bushings. Sounds like that thing really needs to come apart. So be it.
-Greg M.
Well, it was little once! Back in 1978 my first shop was around 150
square feet. That lasted me about a year. Next shop was around 400 sq.
feet. That lasted two years. Third shop was 3300 sq ft, that lasted 35
years...
John :-#)#
I forgot to ask-If you are using contact spray I would wipe the contacts down afterwards.
Is it OK to spray a hot or three of Radio Shack Contact Cleaner on that same Pop Bumper Switch now that I've burnished it with a white credit card, -before I go and button it up again?
That lower playfield flipper seems to be binding on the nylon sleeves. No way to know without pulling it out. I really don't know how to remove the flipper arm assembly but I'm going to try unbolting/unscrewing the entire flipper assembly bracket and dropping it. I have no idea how to pull the flipper arm out when it's attached from the top of the playfield, but hopefully I can figure it out when I try to drop it. If you can give me any directions, that would help me a lot.There are two Allen head screws holding the flipper pawl in place. If
you push on the metal plunger they should become visible.
I'll tell you something. Working on that lower playfield to get to the flipper brackets is a pain in the rear. The upper playfield is smack dab in the middle blocking the lower playfield from being able to elevate it anywhere near where I'd like it to be to work on it. (Even when I prop the top playfield up as high as the top playfield can possibly go.)I take it you don't have the headroom to lift the main playfield up and
lean it back against the headboard (cloth or something to protect paint)?
Thanks again John. I hate that I don't have nice warehouse. That usually doesn't keep me from wrenching on three pins. This time, I'm not so sure. My poor back can't take much more of Black Hole pinball limbo contortion.
-Greg
Yeah, enough space to work is a big help...
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 2:57:20 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 1:53 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 12:19:34 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote: >>>> On 2020/08/29 12:06 p.m., Greg M. wrote:If you are using contact spray I would wipe the contacts down afterwards. >>>
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 11:37:50 AM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote: >>>>>> On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:Ah, sometimes I forget that folks don't have a 5500 sq ft warehouse with >>>> 12 x 12 employee workstations like my little shop. (ducking)
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts. >>>>>> Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my
recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of >>>>>> the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we >>>>>> use them in gear motors...
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ...something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
I have three pins, and no proper room to work on this Black Hole. It's a pathetic Rubix-Cube shuffle-dance of storage space.
It's going to be hard enough just getting under the glass. But I thank you for the links. Definitely.
I'll see if the cleaning of the contacts with a white business card works, and look at the flipper bushings. Sounds like that thing really needs to come apart. So be it.
-Greg M.
Well, it was little once! Back in 1978 my first shop was around 150
square feet. That lasted me about a year. Next shop was around 400 sq. >>>> feet. That lasted two years. Third shop was 3300 sq ft, that lasted 35 >>>> years...
John :-#)#
I forgot to ask-
Is it OK to spray a hot or three of Radio Shack Contact Cleaner on that same Pop Bumper Switch now that I've burnished it with a white credit card, -before I go and button it up again?
That lower playfield flipper seems to be binding on the nylon sleeves. No way to know without pulling it out. I really don't know how to remove the flipper arm assembly but I'm going to try unbolting/unscrewing the entire flipper assembly bracket and dropping it. I have no idea how to pull the flipper arm out when it's attached from the top of the playfield, but hopefully I can figure it out when I try to drop it. If you can give me any directions, that would help me a lot.There are two Allen head screws holding the flipper pawl in place. If
you push on the metal plunger they should become visible.
I take it you don't have the headroom to lift the main playfield up and
I'll tell you something. Working on that lower playfield to get to the flipper brackets is a pain in the rear. The upper playfield is smack dab in the middle blocking the lower playfield from being able to elevate it anywhere near where I'd like it to be to work on it. (Even when I prop the top playfield up as high as the top playfield can possibly go.)
lean it back against the headboard (cloth or something to protect paint)? >>>
Thanks again John. I hate that I don't have nice warehouse. That usually doesn't keep me from wrenching on three pins. This time, I'm not so sure. My poor back can't take much more of Black Hole pinball limbo contortion.Yeah, enough space to work is a big help...
-Greg
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I found those Allen screws. Had no idea what they were there for in that flipper assembly until now.
Thank you SO MUCH JOHN.
Looking at that whole thing now, I initially thought those three-sided Nylon caps on both sides of the flipper bracket were simply dirty, and/or worn. But (also) the flipper coil piston, it's filthy. When you touch it, it's got a thin film on it, and the consistency of tacky glue.
Do you normally clean everything like the coil piston and coil sleeves with solvent like... rubbing alcohol? Or something more serious?
Maybe I ought to be replacing the coil and sleeves. I don't even know if I can order all the proper parts. But I thought you'd have good advice.
And I owe you now. Thank you again.
I never even once have ever tilted a playfield all the way back against the head. I thought for sure it would eventually stress and pull the wire looms hard enough to mess up the playfield or head connections , so all this time I've probably just been making it impossibly difficult for myself. I actually thought that's why they had the prop rods inside the machine to work on it. I mostly cheated, and put a longer hickory handle from a hoe or something and propped it up as far as I could (semi-safely). Dummy me. Figures...
Greg M.
On 2020/08/29 3:49 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 2:57:20 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 1:53 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 12:19:34 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote: >>>> On 2020/08/29 12:06 p.m., Greg M. wrote:If you are using contact spray I would wipe the contacts down afterwards. >>>
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 11:37:50 AM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:Ah, sometimes I forget that folks don't have a 5500 sq ft warehouse with
On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask:No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts.
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other >>>>>> non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my
recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn >>>>>> somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of >>>>>> the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ...something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
use them in gear motors...
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup) >>>>>> John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
I have three pins, and no proper room to work on this Black Hole. It's a pathetic Rubix-Cube shuffle-dance of storage space.
It's going to be hard enough just getting under the glass. But I thank you for the links. Definitely.
I'll see if the cleaning of the contacts with a white business card works, and look at the flipper bushings. Sounds like that thing really needs to come apart. So be it.
-Greg M.
12 x 12 employee workstations like my little shop. (ducking)
Well, it was little once! Back in 1978 my first shop was around 150 >>>> square feet. That lasted me about a year. Next shop was around 400 sq. >>>> feet. That lasted two years. Third shop was 3300 sq ft, that lasted 35 >>>> years...
John :-#)#
I forgot to ask-
Is it OK to spray a hot or three of Radio Shack Contact Cleaner on that same Pop Bumper Switch now that I've burnished it with a white credit card, -before I go and button it up again?
That lower playfield flipper seems to be binding on the nylon sleeves. No way to know without pulling it out. I really don't know how to remove the flipper arm assembly but I'm going to try unbolting/unscrewing the entire flipper assembly bracket and dropping it. I have no idea how to pull the flipper arm out when it's attached from the top of the playfield, but hopefully I can figure it out when I try to drop it. If you can give me any directions, that would help me a lot.There are two Allen head screws holding the flipper pawl in place. If
you push on the metal plunger they should become visible.
I take it you don't have the headroom to lift the main playfield up and >> lean it back against the headboard (cloth or something to protect paint)? >>>
I'll tell you something. Working on that lower playfield to get to the flipper brackets is a pain in the rear. The upper playfield is smack dab in the middle blocking the lower playfield from being able to elevate it anywhere near where I'd like it to be to work on it. (Even when I prop the top playfield up as high as the top playfield can possibly go.)
Thanks again John. I hate that I don't have nice warehouse. That usually doesn't keep me from wrenching on three pins. This time, I'm not so sure. My poor back can't take much more of Black Hole pinball limbo contortion.Yeah, enough space to work is a big help...
-Greg
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I found those Allen screws. Had no idea what they were there for in that flipper assembly until now.
Thank you SO MUCH JOHN.
Looking at that whole thing now, I initially thought those three-sided Nylon caps on both sides of the flipper bracket were simply dirty, and/or worn. But (also) the flipper coil piston, it's filthy. When you touch it, it's got a thin film on it, and the consistency of tacky glue.
Do you normally clean everything like the coil piston and coil sleeves with solvent like... rubbing alcohol? Or something more serious?Varsol or rubbing alcohol are fine, no gasoline or other highly
flammable stuff please...
Maybe I ought to be replacing the coil and sleeves. I don't even know if I can order all the proper parts. But I thought you'd have good advice.You can order those sleeves, etc. from the usual suspects (including my store). The operators manual should give the replacement part numbers
which will make it so much easier to order.
You normally only replace coils when they are damaged or have
overheated. Coil sleeves though, they do wear inside and can usually
stand replacing - at least the flipper coil sleeves if nothing else.
And I owe you now. Thank you again.You are welcome.
I never even once have ever tilted a playfield all the way back against the head. I thought for sure it would eventually stress and pull the wire looms hard enough to mess up the playfield or head connections , so all this time I've probably just been making it impossibly difficult for myself. I actually thought that's why they had the prop rods inside the machine to work on it. I mostly cheated, and put a longer hickory handle from a hoe or something and propped it up as far as I could (semi-safely). Dummy me. Figures...
I should have mentioned to watch the wire harness as you pull the bottom
of the playfield forward so you can tip it way back. I assume you did
that, so good!
John :-#)#
Greg M.
--If I'm not mistaken, the wiring harness to the lower playfield is joined by two block connectors that are easy to discinnect. Whenever I needed to work on mine, I would remove the two machine screws at the front edge and take the whole lower playfield out. Much easier to work on it out of the game than in. I did a full flipper rebuild on all 6 of them years ago and there was nothing too tricky about it. The mechs are seriously overbuilt, and a rebuild will last two lifetimes in home use. Also, the ground mods are pretty important on these machines if you want to stamp out flakey behaviours at best, and blown up transistors and coils/etc at worst.
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 6:57:51 PM UTC-4, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 3:49 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 2:57:20 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:
On 2020/08/29 1:53 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 12:19:34 PM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:If you are using contact spray I would wipe the contacts down afterwards.
On 2020/08/29 12:06 p.m., Greg M. wrote:
On Saturday, August 29, 2020 at 11:37:50 AM UTC-7, John Robertson wrote:Ah, sometimes I forget that folks don't have a 5500 sq ft warehouse with
On 2020/08/29 11:09 a.m., Greg M. wrote:
I checked Google and it was pretty vague. So I need to ask: >>>>>>>No tungsten contacts are used in Black Hole, they are all gold contacts.
Am I able to burnish/file/sand the spoon contacts on my Black Hole pin to hopefully "wake up" the weak response from just one top center pop-bumper? It has really weak initial reaction to a ball hitting it, but once it trips, it smacks it just as hard as any of the others. So,.,, I don't think it needs a coil rebuild. Just maybe the contacts, with a good cleaning with vinegar? (or something.) What do I use? 1200 grit wet and dry? I know on gold contacts you never do this. But on the supposed lower "tungsten" ?? pop bumper cup switches, I really have no idea. so -I need your help.
Polish only with either a piece of white business card or other >>>>>> non-abrasive item.
Weak response may be related to grounds - have you checked my >>>>>> recommended System 80 ground upgrades?
https://www.flippers.com/gottlieb_ground_cures.html
Check the flipper bushing, it may be either the wrong one or worn >>>>>> somehow. They normally last indefinately but perhaps the underside of
Second issue: On the lower playfield, I have a flipper that drags all the time. I don't know why exactly yet, but luckily it doesn't seem to be hurting the playfield, and I read that those flippers have a plastic "tail" or something on a flipper link that some may suggest you grind off, or cut off completely to prevent this. I'm hoping maybe that's all it is.
the flipper shoe assembly is wearing it down?
Lithium based grease should be OK. Not so sure on molylubes, although we
I've never replaced pop bumper coils, or flipper mechanisms. I really don't feel like spending the money and shipping and my time messing things up unless I'm forced to.
Last one is easy. I read that maybe I need to lube drop targets and slingshots. Gottlieb says: Gottlieb "White Lube" do people still use it? Or ...something else now?? Is it lithium grease or (??) - and can I use it on my Williams Earthshaker too?
use them in gear motors...
Thanks for your help
You are welcome,
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup) >>>>>> John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I have considered doing all of your ground mods. (many, many times) And I will once I have more elbow room to work on the backbox. Right now, I'm strapped for space to do a proper job on the head.
I have three pins, and no proper room to work on this Black Hole. It's a pathetic Rubix-Cube shuffle-dance of storage space.
It's going to be hard enough just getting under the glass. But I thank you for the links. Definitely.
I'll see if the cleaning of the contacts with a white business card works, and look at the flipper bushings. Sounds like that thing really needs to come apart. So be it.
-Greg M.
12 x 12 employee workstations like my little shop. (ducking)
Well, it was little once! Back in 1978 my first shop was around 150 >>>> square feet. That lasted me about a year. Next shop was around 400 sq.
feet. That lasted two years. Third shop was 3300 sq ft, that lasted 35
years...
John :-#)#
I forgot to ask-
Is it OK to spray a hot or three of Radio Shack Contact Cleaner on that same Pop Bumper Switch now that I've burnished it with a white credit card, -before I go and button it up again?
There are two Allen head screws holding the flipper pawl in place. If >> you push on the metal plunger they should become visible.
That lower playfield flipper seems to be binding on the nylon sleeves. No way to know without pulling it out. I really don't know how to remove the flipper arm assembly but I'm going to try unbolting/unscrewing the entire flipper assembly bracket and dropping it. I have no idea how to pull the flipper arm out when it's attached from the top of the playfield, but hopefully I can figure it out when I try to drop it. If you can give me any directions, that would help me a lot.
I take it you don't have the headroom to lift the main playfield up and >> lean it back against the headboard (cloth or something to protect paint)?
I'll tell you something. Working on that lower playfield to get to the flipper brackets is a pain in the rear. The upper playfield is smack dab in the middle blocking the lower playfield from being able to elevate it anywhere near where I'd like it to be to work on it. (Even when I prop the top playfield up as high as the top playfield can possibly go.)
Yeah, enough space to work is a big help...
Thanks again John. I hate that I don't have nice warehouse. That usually doesn't keep me from wrenching on three pins. This time, I'm not so sure. My poor back can't take much more of Black Hole pinball limbo contortion.
-Greg
John :-#)#
--
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
I found those Allen screws. Had no idea what they were there for in that flipper assembly until now.
Thank you SO MUCH JOHN.
Looking at that whole thing now, I initially thought those three-sided Nylon caps on both sides of the flipper bracket were simply dirty, and/or worn. But (also) the flipper coil piston, it's filthy. When you touch it, it's got a thin film on it, and the consistency of tacky glue.
Do you normally clean everything like the coil piston and coil sleeves with solvent like... rubbing alcohol? Or something more serious?Varsol or rubbing alcohol are fine, no gasoline or other highly
flammable stuff please...
Maybe I ought to be replacing the coil and sleeves. I don't even know if I can order all the proper parts. But I thought you'd have good advice.You can order those sleeves, etc. from the usual suspects (including my store). The operators manual should give the replacement part numbers which will make it so much easier to order.
You normally only replace coils when they are damaged or have
overheated. Coil sleeves though, they do wear inside and can usually
stand replacing - at least the flipper coil sleeves if nothing else.
And I owe you now. Thank you again.You are welcome.
I never even once have ever tilted a playfield all the way back against the head. I thought for sure it would eventually stress and pull the wire looms hard enough to mess up the playfield or head connections , so all this time I've probably just been making it impossibly difficult for myself. I actually thought that's why they had the prop rods inside the machine to work on it. I mostly cheated, and put a longer hickory handle from a hoe or something and propped it up as far as I could (semi-safely). Dummy me. Figures...
I should have mentioned to watch the wire harness as you pull the bottom of the playfield forward so you can tip it way back. I assume you did that, so good!
John :-#)#
Greg M.
All parts are ordered.--If I'm not mistaken, the wiring harness to the lower playfield is joined by two block connectors that are easy to discinnect. Whenever I needed to work on mine, I would remove the two machine screws at the front edge and take the whole lower playfield out. Much easier to work on it out of the game than in. I did a full flipper rebuild on all 6 of them years ago and there was nothing too tricky about it. The mechs are seriously overbuilt, and a rebuild will last two lifetimes in home use. Also, the ground mods are pretty important on these machines if you want to stamp out flakey behaviours at best, and blown up transistors and coils/etc at worst.
(Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup)
John's Jukes Ltd.
MOVED to #7 - 3979 Marine Way, Burnaby, BC, Canada V5J 5E3
(604)872-5757 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)
www.flippers.com
"Old pinballers never die, they just flip out."
-Brian
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